MotoGP Still think electronics aren't the deal they are? - Page 8

jose_jimenez · 04-03-2008, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBRVFR

I don't want it.

You are stopping development then, turning motorcycling into Nascar racing, and you have no got damn personality then

evl_twn · 04-03-2008, 03:37 PM

You can put it on your current bike now anyway...

Bazzaz Performance - Motorcycle ECU mapping and ignition components. - Z-Fi Traction Control

smoothrideronli · 04-03-2008, 03:58 PM

How does it work without additional sensors? Dont you need speed sensors on the wheel.

CBRVFR · 04-03-2008, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jose_jimenez

You are stopping development then, turning motorcycling into Nascar racing, and you have no got damn personality then

I don't have restrictor plates on any of my carbs..

luvtolean · 04-03-2008, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smoothrideronli

How does it work without additional sensors? Dont you need speed sensors on the wheel.

You have a Hall effect tied to your countershaft for your mile-o-meter.

Take that data, and make sure the rate of change for your acceleration doesn't get out of hand.

Baketech · 04-03-2008, 04:21 PM

Quote:

“Oh c’mon guys, it’s so simple.... maybe you need a refresher course. It’s all ball bearings these days”. - Fletch

jose_jimenez · 04-03-2008, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBRVFR

I don't have restrictor plates on any of my carbs..

Not yet you don't. You are just a mile away from being trash though

gt702 · 04-03-2008, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jose_jimenez

Not yet you don't. You are just a mile away from being trash though

He's a little more than a mile from MIS, but not by much

gt702 · 04-03-2008, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBRVFR

I don't have restrictor plates on any of my carbs..

You don't need no stinking sensors

Quote:

Originally Posted by luvtolean

You have a Hall effect tied to your countershaft for your mile-o-meter.

Take that data, and make sure the rate of change for your acceleration doesn't get out of hand.

That would add to it, but many systems can do it just by rate of change of engine speed, mapped to throttle position, gear, and rpm ... and gear can be inferred from speed (that hall sensor

... or Variable Reluctance Sensor in more advanced systems) and RPM. The hall sensor on the drive would definitely add to the tool box that is already on an electronically controlled engine, especially in a non-track situation where you don't tune it for conditions (reason they have a tech always available)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baketech

Diesel?

slickwill · 04-03-2008, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by evl_twn

You can put it on your current bike now anyway...

Bazzaz Performance - Motorcycle ECU mapping and ignition components. - Z-Fi Traction Control

The first time I have an extra grand laying around I'm getting one of these to play with.

jose_jimenez · 04-05-2008, 03:20 PM

I went to my dealer today and spoke with the manager like I usually do....

He went to the press intro for the new Fireblade. Honda engineers from Japan were there and he got to speak to a couple of them. An engineer told him they wanted to put TC on the new bike but that it came down to cost as to why they didn't. They wanted more than anything to keep the cost down on the new bike, to make the price as close to the outgoing model as possible. That was one of their main goals on the project. TC would have made the price increase to a point where it wasn't feasible this go around. I asked him if he had asked him by how much and their estimate was north of $500 at the time to go into production. So it looks like the new Blade might just be the last non-TC literbike they make. I wouldn't be surprised to see it on the MMC in 2010. LTL, this was for you, as I know you'd want to know these things.....

luvtolean · 04-05-2008, 04:30 PM

Be interesting to know the cost break-out...though I doubt we ever will.

ND4SPD · 04-09-2008, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jose_jimenez

I agree that it will trickle down eventually. Actually the best place for it to be tested is WSBK if it is going to go into production. It's just not something I'd want to pay for, or see prices increase for on new motorcycles. It'll be a hard thing for them to do and it will be interesting to see the legislation (TC should have saved me but didn't). I think of it about like ABS, why isn't ABS on every new Honda motorcycle? It's safer right? (Cost/weight)

Honda Worldwide | Technology Close-up

Baketech · 05-30-2008, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baketech

Now that's an interesting question...

It's hard to glean much information about the technical aspect of those classes. The info is kept fairly close to the vest for a number of reasons...

Imho, I think there are a couple of things that suggest that they currently do, particularly in the 250...

The reduction of highside incidents. During this same period, power and lap times have improved, so it doesn't quite follow that highsides would reduce without reason.
The recent success of the 250 wunderkinds in the GP class. They certainly seem to be more suited to exploiting the current packages, so it would follow that they shortened the learning curve because of previous exposure. Yes, the 250 to GP rider progression has always been a mode, but this era is different in that they appear to get to the head of the class sooner. And yes, others will be quick to point out the "Mite" factor...ie the planetary alignment of smaller riders and now smaller GP machines. Of course it's a combination of many factors, but you have to be open to the notion that the TC skills are being learned before they reach the GP...

In light of this, I would speculate that it is in use...ymmv of course...

I realize that TC is no longer a dirty word now that the "right" people are winning with it...but the last paragraph of this article is interesting:

Soup :: Ryder Notes: False Start :: 05-30-2008

jose_jimenez · 05-31-2008, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baketech

I realize that TC is no longer a dirty word now that the "right" people are winning with it...but the last paragraph of this article is interesting:

Soup :: Ryder Notes: False Start :: 05-30-2008

You think that because Rossi is winning with it?

Well i sure I got to hear and read my stupid shit for the day.

I think you'll find that the people who want it gone, like myself, really don't care who wins, we still want it gone.

ND4SPD · 05-31-2008, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jose_jimenez

You think that because Rossi is winning with it?

Well i sure I got to hear and read my stupid shit for the day.

I think you'll find that the people who want it gone, like myself, really don't care who wins, we still want it gone.

So it's just a coincidence that you stopped b!tching about it about the same time Rossi started producing some results?

jose_jimenez · 05-31-2008, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ND4SPD

So it's just a coincidence that you stopped b!tching about it about the same time Rossi started producing some results?

They won't vote or decide to change the rules until a few months from now.
What is the point in arguing about it right now? It's a dead horse until later in the year when they start discussing if any rule changes need to take place. I hope they ban TC to the F'in max. I hope someone beats Rossi tomorrow too. It's his home race, won it 6 times in a row. If someone beats him tomorrow they'll really have to have the pace. Stoner is looking good this weekend. I hope we see a battle between them both and may the best man win. The processionals are getting old no matter who wins.

phobe · 06-28-2008, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jose_jimenez

I went to my dealer today and spoke with the manager like I usually do....
.....

Was he hiding under his desk when you came in?

jose_jimenez · 06-29-2008, 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phobiaphobe

Was he hiding under his desk when you came in?

Almost a month old thread and now this? Go buy yourself a sucker kid.

jose_jimenez · 06-30-2008, 10:26 AM

Hayden, on this past weekend in Assen:

Quote:

`It is frustrating because we have the system and it should never run out of fuel. We should always make it across the finish line. On the starting grid a light showed up and I knew something wasn´t calibrating right. The bikes have so much electronics now, sometimes it is not the guy who rides hardest that wins it is the guy who hits the right buttons on his computer'.

phobe · 06-30-2008, 10:33 AM

Bit out of character for Haystack to make excuses huh? For quite a few years he's had the best button-pushers.

jose_jimenez · 07-10-2008, 10:15 AM

Hacking talking about the ZXRR MotoGp machine that he'll get to ride @ Laguna.

Quote:

It's an amazing machine. I can't believe how sophisticated the electronics package is on the bike; already it feels like you can open the gas impossibly early out of the turns, but the data shows that it's actually possible to open the throttle even earlier. To do this requires some confidence in the electronics, and that confidence will only come with more track time on the bike.

MotoVegas · 07-15-2008, 10:14 AM

Might as well post the latest counter-point evidence since it appears this thread, like Frankenstein, continues to live despite all of us

of our own particular view:

Guintoli sixth without traction control! | MOTOGP News

jose_jimenez · 08-18-2008, 12:15 PM

Cycle World - CW 5Q: Valentino Rossi

04-03-2008, 03:37 PM	#212
evl_twn CAN CRUSHER Join Date: 12-13-2006 Location: Central Illinois Age: 40 Bike(s): worm gear Posts: 1,658	You can put it on your current bike now anyway... Bazzaz Performance - Motorcycle ECU mapping and ignition components. - Z-Fi Traction Control __________________ Seamus is awesome

04-03-2008, 03:58 PM	#213
smoothrideronli www.calendartreats.com Join Date: 12-18-2006 Location: New York Age: 34 Bike(s): 2004 1000RR, 2008 1000RR Posts: 1,375	How does it work without additional sensors? Dont you need speed sensors on the wheel. __________________

04-05-2008, 03:20 PM	#221
jose_jimenez Not Sure's Legal Representation Join Date: 01-05-2007 Bike(s): Hurricane Posts: 1,983	I went to my dealer today and spoke with the manager like I usually do.... He went to the press intro for the new Fireblade. Honda engineers from Japan were there and he got to speak to a couple of them. An engineer told him they wanted to put TC on the new bike but that it came down to cost as to why they didn't. They wanted more than anything to keep the cost down on the new bike, to make the price as close to the outgoing model as possible. That was one of their main goals on the project. TC would have made the price increase to a point where it wasn't feasible this go around. I asked him if he had asked him by how much and their estimate was north of $500 at the time to go into production. So it looks like the new Blade might just be the last non-TC literbike they make. I wouldn't be surprised to see it on the MMC in 2010. LTL, this was for you, as I know you'd want to know these things..... __________________ http://www.bushslastday.com/

04-05-2008, 04:30 PM	#222
luvtolean Join Date: 12-13-2006 Location: SF Bay Area, CA Bike(s): 2008 BMW GS-A Posts: 6,396	Be interesting to know the cost break-out...though I doubt we ever will. __________________ The facility and excess of law-making seem to be the diseases to which are governments are most liable.- James Madison Last edited by luvtolean; 04-05-2008 at 05:51 PM.

06-30-2008, 10:33 AM	#231
phobe circa 1970 Join Date: 12-17-2006 Age: 26 Bike(s): 600RR, 125R Posts: 4,644	Bit out of character for Haystack to make excuses huh? For quite a few years he's had the best button-pushers. __________________ Cum hoc, ergo propter hoc

07-15-2008, 10:14 AM	#233
MotoVegas Join Date: 01-03-2007 Location: Las Vegas Age: 38 Bike(s): ZX-10R & HD Ultra Classic Posts: 896	Might as well post the latest counter-point evidence since it appears this thread, like Frankenstein, continues to live despite all of us of our own particular view: Guintoli sixth without traction control! \| MOTOGP News __________________ Enjoy my pics Enjoy my crash Enjoy riding with Whip and I at SMMR

08-18-2008, 12:15 PM	#234
jose_jimenez Not Sure's Legal Representation Join Date: 01-05-2007 Bike(s): Hurricane Posts: 1,983	Cycle World - CW 5Q: Valentino Rossi __________________ http://www.bushslastday.com/