Thread: Lead Ban Stops Youth ATV and Motorcycle Sales

It hasn't yet, and probably won't stop anything. This is a typical, overwrought, badly written legislative reaction to Chinese lead-polluted chew toys for infants. Not really likely that an infant will be able to get the lead battery terminals off a minibike in time for lunch..

The Act states that the CPSC will publish a rule providing guidance about a general exception for parts or components that are “not accessible to a child through normal and reasonably foreseeable use and abuse.” That description includes swallowing, mouthing, breaking, other children’s activity and product aging. We’re no lawyer firm, but his seems like a possible way for motorcycles and ATVs to find some relief, though delayed.

To find out exactly what the ban means, we sent a list of questions to Taryn Sanchez, Senior Media Coordinator for the MIC, and this is what the Council had to say.

What exactly happens on Feb 10 for motorcycle dealers?
"On February 10 large inventories of motorcycle and ATV products that present no health risk to children could be rendered retroactively illegal and future products prohibited from sale. These products may need to be destroyed resulting in severe hardship for dealers and manufacturers in the motorcycle industry. Along with the current state of the economy, this may be a hit that dealers and manufacturers will not be able to recover from."

Isn't it uncomfortable when your uh, nose gets pulled around by lobbyists all day?

This is what happens when we pass bills without debate in the face of some real, or imagined, crisis.

"For the children..."

I just heard of this today.. ridiculous. From what I hear it goes beyond that. It started with same people who were trying to keep kids under 16 off quads. Now kids under 12 are in danger of all motorcycles and atv's of lead?? Trying to ban the imports of all jap bikes and quads made for kids 12 and under. If this happens it’s about time the people take this country back.

Before that it was the successful banning of 3-wheelers.

This has nothing to do with lead. More with bad journalism.

See page 57 in the document.

Page 58 and 59.

Lead may apply, it looks to me like it does, but the performance stuff is even worse!

From a medical standpoint lead issues just isn't something I see in the clinic on a daily basis, or even a monthly one. On the other hand I see kids everyday suffering from effects of secondhand smoke.

So folks this is no longer a rumor. It is now in effect. You can no longer purchase an 85cc or below dirt bike or quad. I'm unbelievably pissed about this. To the point I think someone needs to shot to be set an example of. My boss who has a 12 year old son currently has a KX 65 went into the local dealer to buy a KX 85 for him. He told the dealer he needed a pit bike for himself. The dealer said maybe so, but they aren't going to lose their license over a sale. The bikes have been pulled. Some may think it’s not a big deal because they don't have kids, or it’s not that big of deal. As a child we didn't have cable tv or a video game system. There were two main highlights of my childhood. Being outside and building BMX tracks with shovels and wheel borrows and being able to ride a mini bike freely in the back yard. This has been taken away from my child. Apparently if I were to try to sell his PW50 and the wrong person found out I'd be fined 100,000 dollars. On top of that the parts productions to these bikes are supposed to be stopped to the US. ALSO this is supposed to apply to BMX bikes with something like 26 inch wheels or below, (because bicycles also contain lead) but is currently being overlooked. It is the letter of the law. Maybe we should start taking things away from the people that started this crap.. Things THEY enjoy, and for stupid reasons. Someone please tell me what the definition of socialism is? Is this not a step toward that?

http://www.roadracingworld.com/news/...?article=35563

http://www.amadirectlink.com/legisltn/rapidresponse.asp

Representative Tom Self | Official Website

Originally Posted by RedRider

Representative Tom Self | Official Website

Filled out the form. Not sure if thats all I can do. This is out of hand.

Originally Posted by RedRider

Check the other links I added.

Got it..

You other guys please fill this (these) out too. Even if you don't have kids or they are grown.

Holy shit!! What?! You really can't go buy an 80 anymore? Is that a real story?

FFS.

I did the link and sent it on to my redneck buddies. My type of childhood is gone if this is true, which I find immensely sad. We spent every hour we could on our dirtbikes (YZ80 for me!) and shooting .22s (with ultra-evil 30 round magazines). They already took the .22s away from kids, and now this?

I sent it, hysterical bullshit that it is... Typical of a poor lobbying effort, it didn't allow additions to their prepared text.

Politicians easily discount that kind of message, since they can be spammed and falsified so easily.

If you really care about this, follow up with a simple message in your own words, delivered from your own email address, outside of the self-important AMA, which is about as effective as a legislative advocate for motorcyclists as it is a racing organization.

Originally Posted by CBRVFR

I sent it, hysterical bullshit that it is...

Yeah, I'm going to a dealer to check up on this a bit over the weekend. After that, I'll write a letter with the proper tone.

I'm a bit disappointed though, nary a "hyperbolic" in sight.

I used that once last week.. don't want to wear it out.

I just went by the local dealer and all their small bikes and ATV's are gone, not sure what they did with them. The owner wasn't there, but I asked the parts guys and they said they're not even allowed to sell or order parts for the smaller models anymore, including parts that were ordered BEFORE the ban.

Originally Posted by evl_twn

I just went by the local dealer and all their small bikes and ATV's are gone, not sure what they did with them. The owner wasn't there, but I asked the parts guys and they said they're not even allowed to sell or order parts for the smaller models anymore, including parts that were ordered BEFORE the ban.

MOTHERFUCKER!! This is getting too real, and way too familiar.

Were the little 4 stroke 125s gone? The Mrs has been dying for one but I insisted we hold off until we had done some debt payoff.

Edit: Confirmed at the manufacturer level. The 140s look clean at least:

Go look at the KX65 and KLX110:
http://www.kawasaki.com/Products/Motorcycles.aspx

And Yamaha:
http://www.yamaha-motor.com/sport/pr..._overview.aspx

My dad would hardly believe me when I called him and told him about this. Now he's wondering what else is banned. Are powerwheels included in the list? He's nervous as that's one of his favorite toys for the grandkids.

I just found this on another site

More info.......
http://cpsc.gov/cpscpub/prerel/prhtml09/09120.html

this is from the site....For now, the ban has kind of been postponed

As announced on January 30, 2009, the Commission approved a one year stay of enforcement for certain testing and certification requirements for manufacturers and importers. Significant to makers of children’s products, the ‘stay’ provides limited relief from the testing and certification for total lead content limits, phthalates limits for certain products and mandatory toy standards. Manufacturers and importers – large and small – of children’s products will not need to test or certify to these new requirements, but will still need to meet the lead and phthalates limits, mandatory toy standards and other requirements. Certification based on testing by an accredited laboratory is still required for painted children’s products and soon will be required for children’s metal jewelry, as well as certain other products for non-lead issues.

Makes it sound like there is hope and maybe the dealers didn't get the word? I don't know.

My brother said he was just at Costco and they have youth ATV's on the floor right now.

Originally Posted by luvtolean

Holy shit!! What?! You really can't go buy an 80 anymore? Is that a real story?

Yes...it really is the "real" story. I was there. I don't understand AT ALL how they are getting away with this. Some how or another this has to change.

Originally Posted by slickwill

I just found this on another site



Makes it sound like there is hope and maybe the dealers didn't get the word? I don't know.

My brother said he was just at Costco and they have youth ATV's on the floor right now.

Anyone who sells new or used atv's or motorcycles that are intended for kids 12 and under will be fined $100,000. This includes privite individuals. Also the lead limit is 600 parts pr million which is basically none!

Originally Posted by 08silvercbr

Yes...it really is the "real" story. I was there. I don't understand AT ALL how they are getting away with this. Some how or another this has to change.

Yes, after surfing the manufacturer's sites, I have absolutely no reason to doubt your story.

Originally Posted by 08silvercbr

Yes...it really is the "real" story. I was there. I don't understand AT ALL how they are getting away with this. Some how or another this has to change.

I totally believe you as well. I read parts of the bill and I checked the manu. sites as well which points to the truth. That "addendum" looks legit though as well. I'm just not sure how it applies.

This is letter that the Honda dealer got:

January 23, 2009

Dear Honda Dealer:

On August 14, 2008, Congress enacted the Consumer Product Safety Improvement Act of 2008 (CPSIA or Act). The Act was primarily in reaction to the recent influx of lead-tainted toys that resulted in numerous recalls and significant public outcry for more stringent government standards.

The CPSIA requires manufacturers of “Children’s Products,” defined as those products designed or intended primarily for children 12 years of age or younger, to meet increasingly stringent lead paint and lead content standards and to certify, based on third party testing, that the products meet the Act’s requirements. Products that fail to comply with the prescribed lead limits are considered a “banned hazardous substance” and cannot be sold or offered for sale. Violation of the prescribed limits (initial limits detailed below) can result in severe civil and criminal penalties.

Ban of lead in paint over 600ppm (parts per million)
Honda’s paint contains little or no lead and easily complies with even the most stringent requirement.

Ban of lead in substrate material over 600ppm
Honda is still in process of completing tests on all of the materials used in our small ATV’s and motorcycles; however, some alloy materials commonly used to manufacture motor vehicles may inherently contain levels of lead that are (or ultimately will be) above the current, or future more aggressive, limits set forth in the Act.

Honda and other members of the Motorcycle Industry Council and Specialty Vehicle Institute of America, which face the same issues as Honda, are actively working to exempt the alloy parts for small motorcycles and ATVs from the terms of the Act. The lead embedded in the alloys used in these products is not transferred through typical use of these products. Our shared belief is that Congress never intended the lead content provisions of the Act, which originally were aimed at toys that can be mouthed by children, to be applicable to small ATVs and motorcycles.

Even more concerning is that the Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC), the agency charged with enforcing the Act, recently ruled that Congress intended the lead content regulations to be retroactive. This means that, regardless of its date of manufacture or the fact that it complied with all applicable laws and regulations at the date of manufacture, any children’s product manufactured with even a single component part containing lead in excess of the limits will no longer be legal for sale as of February 10, 2009. The economic impact of the CPSC’s ruling will be substantial for both dealers and manufacturers in an already weakened economy.

What all of this means to you is that – without Congressional or CPSC action -- you will not be able to sell new or used TRX 90, CRF 50F, CRF 70F, or CRF 80F models after February 10, 2009, stranding your investment in your new and used inventory. In fact, under the terms of the Act you cannot even display these models on your showroom floor, distribute brochures, or advertise them on your website.

As Honda and others continue to work towards a satisfactory resolution to this dilemma, we urge you to support an industry effort by contacting your Congressional delegation and Senators and urging them to ensure that small motorcycles and ATVs are exempted from the lead-content provisions of the Act. Copies of letters already sent by the MIC and SVIA to various members of Congress are attached for your reference.

We ask for your patience and understanding as we work through this unfortunate process together. You may continue to sell these models lawfully and with all existing Honda retail support through February 9th, 2009. We will advise you if the industry is able to obtain an exemption from the lead content regulation. In the interim, we will keep you posted on developments and business actions necessary from February 10th forward to comply with this Act.


With best regards,

American Honda Motor Co., Inc.

Ray Blank
Senior Vice-President
Motorcycle Division

Here is your hit list.. oh wait I better not say that because free speech is no longer allowed either. What I meat was here are the people responsible for signing this nonsense:

EDIT: Not that this is a coincidence or anything but notice how many were D and how many were R. Also note I'm not partial to D or R, but stupid people.

Sponsor

Rep. Bobby Rush [D-IL]

Cosponsors [as of 2009-01-09]
Del. Madeleine Bordallo [D-GU]
Rep. James Walsh [R-NY]
Rep. Zachary Space [D-OH]
Rep. Sheila Jackson-Lee [D-TX]
Rep. Silvestre Reyes [D-TX]
Rep. Baron Hill [D-IN]
Rep. Robert Scott [D-VA]
Rep. Carolyn McCarthy [D-NY]
Rep. George Butterfield [D-NC]
Rep. Raymond Green [D-TX]
Rep. Barton Gordon [D-TN]
Rep. Yvette Clarke [D-NY]
Rep. Dave Reichert [R-WA]
Rep. Dennis Moore [D-KS]
Rep. Greg Walden [R-OR]
Rep. Eliot Engel [D-NY]
Rep. Nita Lowey [D-NY]
Rep. Charles Melancon [D-LA]
Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz [D-FL]
Rep. Sam Farr [D-CA]
Rep. Alcee Hastings [D-FL]
Rep. Kathy Castor [D-FL]
Rep. Dennis Cardoza [D-CA]
Rep. Stephanie Herseth Sandlin [D-SD]
Rep. Keith Ellison [D-MN]
Rep. Michael McNulty [D-NY]
Rep. Clifford Stearns [R-FL]
Rep. Ed Perlmutter [D-CO]
Rep. Nancy Boyda [D-KS]
Rep. Daniel Lipinski [D-IL]
Rep. Joe Barton [R-TX]
Rep. Earl Pomeroy [D-ND]
Rep. Gary Ackerman [D-NY]
Rep. Nicholas Lampson [D-TX]
Rep. Jason Altmire [D-PA]
Rep. Jerry McNerney [D-CA]
Rep. Michael Burgess [R-TX]
Rep. Edolphus Towns [D-NY]
Rep. Diana DeGette [D-CO]
Rep. Ellen Tauscher [D-CA]
Rep. Hilda Solis [D-CA]
Rep. Charles Gonzalez [D-TX]
Rep. Dale Kildee [D-MI]
Rep. Tim Mahoney [D-FL]
Rep. Sanford Bishop [D-GA]
Rep. Gabrielle Giffords [D-AZ]
Rep. Thomas Allen [D-ME]
Rep. Bennie Thompson [D-MS]
Rep. Peter Visclosky [D-IN]
Rep. Laura Richardson [D-CA]
Rep. Doris Matsui [D-CA]
Rep. Jeffrey Fortenberry [R-NE]
Rep. James Langevin [D-RI]
Rep. Charles Wilson [D-OH]
Rep. Loretta Sanchez [D-CA]
Rep. Kirsten Gillibrand [D-NY]
Rep. Allen Boyd [D-FL]
Rep. Joe Courtney [D-CT]
Rep. Joe Donnelly [D-IN]
Rep. Henry Johnson [D-GA]
Rep. Melissa Bean [D-IL]
Rep. John Dingell [D-MI]
Rep. Jane Harman [D-CA]
Rep. Lynn Woolsey [D-CA]
Rep. Barbara Lee [D-CA]
Rep. Tammy Baldwin [D-WI]
Rep. John Hall [D-NY]
Rep. Phil Hare [D-IL]
Rep. Al Green [D-TX]
Rep. Robert Berry [D-AR]
Rep. Joe Sestak [D-PA]
Rep. Janice Schakowsky [D-IL]
Rep. Jim Matheson [D-UT]
Rep. Peter Welch [D-VT]
Rep. Marcy Kaptur [D-OH]
Rep. Rahm Emanuel [D-IL]
Rep. William Clay [D-MO]
Rep. John Barrow [D-GA]
Rep. Jay Inslee [D-WA]
Rep. Christopher Van Hollen [D-MD]
Rep. Albio Sires [D-NJ]
Rep. Danny Davis [D-IL]
Rep. Betty Sutton [D-OH]
Rep. John Sarbanes [D-MD]
Rep. Frederick Boucher [D-VA]
Rep. Bart Stupak [D-MI]
Rep. Michael Honda [D-CA]
Rep. Paul Hodes [D-NH]
Rep. James Moran [D-VA]
Rep. Eddie Johnson [D-TX]
Rep. Edward Pastor [D-AZ]
Rep. Elijah Cummings [D-MD]
Rep. Edward Whitfield [R-KY]
Rep. Albert Wynn [D-MD]
Rep. Carol Shea-Porter [D-NH]
Rep. Mike Ross [D-AR]
Rep. Michael Doyle [D-PA]
Rep. Lois Capps [D-CA]
Rep. Christopher Murphy [D-CT]
Rep. Henry Waxman [D-CA]
Rep. John Larson [D-CT]
Rep. Rubén Hinojosa [D-TX]
Rep. Peter DeFazio [D-OR]
Rep. Emanuel Cleaver [D-MO]
Rep. Darlene Hooley [D-OR]
Rep. James Clyburn [D-SC]