luvtolean

Anyone got the info on dealer cost for the loaded 5 door STi and/or the Acura TL Type S?

Any other suggestions for sporty $30-40k 4 doors?

__________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries. - Winston Churchill

jose_jimenez

both cars you listed can be had for invoice.

Is MPG a concern?

__________________
http://www.bushslastday.com/

luvtolean

The invoice prices I'm seeing are all old, do you know what it is(or have a site), especially on the STi? MSRP is about $40k with the nav and BBS wheels...

MPG a concern? A minor one I suppose. She wants 4 doors and performance...she knows this one will get worse than the S2k.

Also, A3 Quattro looks pretty fun.

__________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries. - Winston Churchill

ND4SPD

Does it need 4 doors? BMW 335i or even the 135i are sweet rides.

__________________
"This is your life - are you who you want to be?"
Learn all you need to know about Mac OS X
"Chuck Norris can slam a revolving door"

slickwill

I personally think it has the best styling of what you have listed. I really like them inside and out. They were everywhere in Germany so when I got home I had to go to the dealership to check out the US versions. I'm not sure how long term reliability compared to the others.

I like the two beamers as well but the Audi isn't already on every other street corner like the 335.

__________________
If it has wheels, I've crashed it, and some things that don't skis, snowmobile, card board box, giant tube, sentra, dirtbike, lawn tractor, grandmas bread tray, kayak, canoe, raft, bicycle, waterskis, tobaggan, horse, ATV, Now my CBR (women)

luvtolean

A3 Quattros were gone at the local dealer, test drove a loaded A3 and it was really really nice. Cool sales-guys, and in past experience with a friend who bought there, very professional dealer.

Went to a Subie dealer and got the worst sales-dick ever. I knew it was wrong from the minute he started talking but the lady was asking questions so I let her do it. Wouldn't do a test drive in the STi without who knows what, but in the middle of his BS dissertation I nodded my head and we left him mid-sentence.

Went to Honda next, the dealer we bought the S2K from, and got typical arrogant Honda dealer horseshit (they were the only Honda dealer that didn't do this when we bought the S2K). The salesguy was all right, but he said the manager wouldn't do a test ride in an Accord V6 or Si 4 door, both of which she was interested in, without a f'ing credit check. Based on our experience with 4 different Honda dealers now, only way I see us ever buying another Honda is if we decide to pay off the residual and keep the S2K.

Because it was near we wandered around the Porsche dealer, and even after telling the guy we were just lookie loos, got WAY more help than at either Subaru dealer #1, or Honda. Amazing.

She test drove an STi, at the SECOND Subie dealer we went to, and that car is surprisingly refined compared to the last WRX. It hauls ass of course, but still has a couple quirks, no hangers for a suit, and the arm rest is too short for short people who put the seat way forward. We actually ended up talking turkey but we didn't quite get there. Very professional sales department and manager. I'd say the deal is still a possibility.


At this point who knows, keep the S2K, buy an A3, or maybe the Subie dealer decides they really want to sell the car and call us back.

Edit:

Maybe not exactly, but she really wants a car that will fit 4 adults reasonably comfortably, and is easy to get in and out of.

Otherwise, we just keep the S2K and continue to use my truck for short trips with 4.

Hehe. This is the Bay Area, you can't swing a dead cat on the freeway without hitting a German car- Mercedes, Audi, Porsche or Bimmer. If you want to be unusual here, buy an H2. (Hummer of Silicon Valley went out of business several months back)

__________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries. - Winston Churchill

SomeStrangeGuy

A friend I work with has an A3 and I gotta say it's really a car I'd like to spend some more time with. It moves when bothered, but he chipped it and did some other things and now the car rips. Speed is really on par with handling - and I can fit in the back seat!

__________________
Come find yourself - GPS Discussion Forums
Time is the ultimate currency.

jose_jimenez

For either it's about 35 and some change. You can look up the invoices on Edmunds and get more detailed info from the forums online for each respective car. I spent way too much time on the Sti, so there isn't much about that car that I don't know.

I looked at both of these cars and many more and went with the Si Sedan. I would seriously exert some effort into looking for something more fuel efficient than the choices listed. The Si Sedan with Nav, and about $1k for the option HFP suspension is pretty damn good. The car weighs less than 3000 lbs and you can feel it. It also has enough power to pass whatever you need on the open road. It does commuting well, vacation travel well, and it can return excellent MPG if you learn how to drive the car. I beat on mine, and average 28MPG. If I would go at it more docile, that would increase to 30MPG.

Unless I gained 6 figures in my yearly income, there is no way in hell I'd be looking at the Sti, MPG is just shit. The TL in either basic or Type S trim is just too heavy, and too much understeer (FWD). The new TL is almost here so I would wait for that if it has to be a luxury car. Honda will be making an AWD version of it this go round. For the type of car she is looking at, the best choices are < 12 months away so I'd wait it out. Also consider the used market for these types of vehicles. Luxury 4 doors are taking massive hits right now so a used Audi or Bimmer is much more affordable than a few years ago. If it were me I'd be buying a fucking Prius, not for the green deal, but to save $.

__________________
http://www.bushslastday.com/

luvtolean

Thanks Jose, I know you went through this fairly recently and I think you were even dumping an S2K. We sat in the loaded 4 door Si and did like it, hell, had they let her drive it, I think she might have bought the damn thing for sticker. But the dude really did piss her off...

Hybrid anything around here is $5k mark-up, and a waiting list at that. They're just not that efficient; that is 1000 gallons of gas, or 20,000+ miles worth in a STi. The Honda salesman told me they just offered someone $15k for his immaculate H2 though.

We would like better milage, but we want a nice, fun car, and have the means...

After checking them out, she just doesn't like most of the std 4 door luxury cars (TL is out), except the beautiful RS4 they had at Audi, until she saw the $75k price. She really likes the "cute", short 5 doors.

__________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries. - Winston Churchill

luvtolean

Did it have the sunroof or whatever they call it? I sat in the back for test rides today, and my hair was just skimming it on bumps.

I couldn't believe it, but the STi was more roomy in back. Not quite as comfortable overall though.

__________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries. - Winston Churchill

Baketech

EDIT:
Post removed...forgot you lived in sunny Kelly Fornea...

So I change my recommendation to a pair of Honda Fits instead...

__________________
"Ten times more charming than that Arnold on Green Acres..."

slickwill

Did I mention I REALLY like the A3? I also think it is a little more 'grown-up' than the STi or Si. I also have thing for the five door look. I had NEVER seen a single one in Des Moines. When I got to Germany there was a GIANT billboard with one on it directly across from my brother's apartment. I went down to the Audi dealership while I was there. Once I got to Des Moines I checked them out again. I've now seen one here. I'll never buy a new car though, I think it's a waste. The sales guy told me they had a bunch out on two year leases. That means they'll come back just in time for my graduation in May of '10. Perfect for me to pick them up for cheap.

__________________
If it has wheels, I've crashed it, and some things that don't skis, snowmobile, card board box, giant tube, sentra, dirtbike, lawn tractor, grandmas bread tray, kayak, canoe, raft, bicycle, waterskis, tobaggan, horse, ATV, Now my CBR (women)

ND4SPD

The A3 is the same car as the VW GTI. I drove the GTI and it was impressive. The dealer was trying real hard to sell it to me, I probably could've got it for about $20k.

A recent Subaru dealer experience has also turned me off of buying one. I love the cars but they weren't too interested in trying to sell me one. I walked in there with a pre-approval letter and book values on the used WRX I was interested in as well as my car and they still wouldn't budge a dime on either price. I got up and walked out on them twice. A month later the car was still there.

FWIW, I've found the high end car dealers to be far more accommodating than the 'common' car lots. A while back I went to check out an IS250. It was winter, snowing, and 15 minutes before closing. The salesman tossed me the keys and told me to go have fun, and simply asked not to stay out too late past closing time. Didn't even come with me on the test ride.

Also looked at a CPO 325i at the local BMW dealer and as the salesman was telling me about the car we pulled into an industrial complex with a winding entrance he put the thing sideways to show me how the vehicle stability control recovers it and encouraged me to do the same when we swapped.

__________________
"This is your life - are you who you want to be?"
Learn all you need to know about Mac OS X
"Chuck Norris can slam a revolving door"

Heavy-Dee

Whoa? What's this?

__________________

ND4SPD

Which part?

__________________
"This is your life - are you who you want to be?"
Learn all you need to know about Mac OS X
"Chuck Norris can slam a revolving door"

Heavy-Dee

CPO?

__________________

ND4SPD

Certified Pre Owned

__________________
"This is your life - are you who you want to be?"
Learn all you need to know about Mac OS X
"Chuck Norris can slam a revolving door"

Heavy-Dee

Ahhh, got it. Little thick this morning....

__________________

slickwill

I too was hoping it meant something cool like the 'COPO' in 'COPO Camaro.'


As far as gas mileage, does it have to be the A3 Quattro? The 2.0 is supposed to give nearly 30mpg and has 200hp. That's not huge power but certainly more than adequate for a car that size. My SE-R specV has 190 and is plenty fun (probably has more torque though). The 2.0 also got a 2008 International Engine of the Year award.

__________________
If it has wheels, I've crashed it, and some things that don't skis, snowmobile, card board box, giant tube, sentra, dirtbike, lawn tractor, grandmas bread tray, kayak, canoe, raft, bicycle, waterskis, tobaggan, horse, ATV, Now my CBR (women)

jose_jimenez

Go look at the Audi A3 Sportback, and the A4 Avant then. The A4 Avant is pretty damn nice, 5 door, sporty, good handling, on and on. CPO ones can be found for good deals. The interior is excellent (Audis are THE standard for interior), nice options available. I'd stick to the 2.0T so you have the power, and when you want to get MPG, you can stay out of boost.

FTR, I looked at and did research on:

TL
TL Type S
G35 Sedan
Sti
Evo X
335i Sedan
135i

And a few others I don't recall at the moment. Pretty much everything from 25-40k. I did like the R32 (VW) but couldn't bring myself to go near a VW after having friends with horrid experiences with the make. I also looked pretty hard at the Volvo C30 but they want way too much money for their options. I'd still try another Honda dealer on the Si Sedan. Due to the relative low weight, driving it is quite nice. I drove the TL Type S immediately after, and you could really feel the weight, then I drove everything else and decided that light was right, and the cheap purchasing cost helped as well.

__________________
http://www.bushslastday.com/

luvtolean

We drove the 2.0l sportback with auto. It was more zippy than the numbers suggest, milage on the sticker was 20/29 IIRC.

When I woke up she'd found another dealer with an Si actually. She can (easily) afford an STi, but she just might buy the Si and...start bagging the extra couple hundy a month as part of her Carrera S down payment. Hmmm...

__________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries. - Winston Churchill

phobe

EVO X GSRs have not met sales expectations and you could probably have one with a decent discount.

On Japanese cars as a rule of thumb figure on 5-8% markup from dealer net to MSRP. There may be a 1 or 2% dealer holdback but don't expect the dealer to sell you a vehicle at cost unless it's been on their lot for 90+ days.

And FWIW, car dealers in the US are well-schooled on all the bargain-shopping tips out there... buying at "invoice" for example. They have stayed one step ahead of Joe Customer and now publish an arbitrary "invoice" price that has nothing to do with the invoice cost of the car. It's the "feel good" price to make people think they're getting an amazing deal.

__________________
Cum hoc, ergo propter hoc

MrX

Even though I'm a huge STi fan, have you looked at the Lexus IS series?

__________________
Summer should never ever ever end.